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alohacyberian

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Apr 18, 2001, 10:38:45 PM4/18/01
to
At a fundraising dinner for a school that serves learning disabled
children, the father of one of the school's students delivered a speech
that would never be forgotten by all who attended. After extolling the
school and its dedicated staff, he offered a question.

"Everything God does is done with perfection. Yet, my son, Shay, cannot
learn things as other children do. He cannot understand things as other
children do. Where is God's plan reflected in my son?"

The audience was stilled by the query.

The father continued. "I believe," the father answered, "that when God
brings a child like Shay into the world, an opportunity to realize the
Divine Plan presents itself. And it comes in the way people treat that
child."Then, he told the following story:

Shay and his father had walked past a park where some boys Shay knew were
playing baseball. Shay asked, "Do you think they will let me play?"
Shay's father knew that most boys would not want him on their team. But
the father understood that if his son were allowed to play it would give
him a much needed sense of belonging.

Shay's father approached one of the boys on the field and asked if Shay
could play. The boy looked around for guidance from his teammates. Getting
none, he took matters into his own hands and said, "We are losing by six
runs, and the game is in the eighth inning. I guess he can be on our team
and we'll try to put him up to bat in the ninth inning."

In the bottom of the eighth inning, Shay's team scored a few runs but was
still behind by three. At the top of the ninth inning, Shay put on a glove
and played in the outfield. Although no hits came his way, he was
obviously ecstatic just to be on the field, grinning from ear to ear as his
father waved to him from the stands. In the bottom of the ninth inning,
Shay's team scored again. Now, with two outs and the bases loaded, the
potential winning run was on base.

Shay was scheduled to be the next "at bat". Would the team actually let
Shay bat at this juncture and give away their chance to win the game?

Surprisingly, Shay was given the bat. Everyone knew that a hit was all but
impossible because Shay didn't even know how to hold the bat properly, much
less connect with the ball. However, as Shay stepped up to the plate, the
pitcher moved a few steps to lob the ball in softly so Shay could at least
be able to make contact. The first pitch came and Shay swung clumsily and
missed. The pitcher again took a few steps forward to toss the ball softly
toward Shay.

As the pitch came in, Shay swung at the ball and hit a slow ground ball to
the pitcher. The pitcher picked up the soft grounder and could easily have
thrown the ball to the first baseman. Shay would have been out and that
would have ended the game. Instead, the pitcher took the ball and threw it
on a high arc to right field, far beyond reach of the first baseman.

Everyone started yelling, "Shay, run to first. Run to first." Never in his
life had Shay ever made it to first base. He scampered down the baseline,
wide-eyed and startled. Everyone yelled, "Run to second, run to second!"
By the time Shay was rounding first base, the right fielder had the ball.
He could have thrown the ball to the second baseman for a tag. But the
right fielder understood what the pitcher's intentions had been, so he
threw the ball high and far over the third baseman's head. Shay ran
towards second base as the runners ahead of him deliriously circled the
bases towards home. As Shay reached second base, the opposing shortstop ran
to him, turned him in the direction of third base, and shouted, "Run to
third!" As Shay rounded third, the boys from both teams were screaming,
"Shay! Run home!"

Shay ran home, stepped on home plate and was cheered as the hero, for
hitting a "grand slam" and winning the game for his team.

"That day," said the father softly with tears now rolling down his face,
"the boys from both teams helped bring a piece of the Divine Plan into this
world."

Winning isn't always the most important choice.
--
(-:alohacyberian:-) At my website there are 3000 live cameras or
visit NASA, play games, read jokes, send greeting cards & connect
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The Hateful Donut

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Apr 19, 2001, 1:22:23 AM4/19/01
to
Oh how heartwarming. Pass the Rolaids.

You can thank the Democrats in Congress for making sure that disabled
students have every right to a public education. More often than not,
disabled students are turned away by faith-based schools, simply because
they do not have to follow the same laws. As a result, public schools are
often slammed for being "more expensive" than sending a kid to spend the day
learning with Prevo and his ilk. It's all too easy to overlook the cost of
a public education for a disabled student, which can run into the tens of
thousands per school year, versus just a few thousand for a "regular"
student.

I guess the moral of the story is that it's okay to lie to challenged
students and create a phony world for them, because they won't be able to
put two-and-two together, as long as it's done under the guise of "being
godly". Puh-leeeeze.


"alohacyberian" <alohac...@att.net> wrote in message
news:01c0c87b$d966cee0$1980480c@KeithMartin...

Some guy

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Apr 19, 2001, 2:09:19 AM4/19/01
to
Maybe because faithbased schools are private, they aren't always equipped to
deal with the needs of all children? Is that true anyway? How did you arrive
at that conclusion about faith based schools turning away special needs
kids? And are you trying to say that only democrats help out special needs
people?

>
> I guess the moral of the story is that it's okay to lie to challenged
> students and create a phony world for them, because they won't be able to
> put two-and-two together, as long as it's done under the guise of "being
> godly". Puh-leeeeze.
>

Please explain this line?


Floyd Davidson

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Apr 19, 2001, 2:16:02 AM4/19/01
to
"The Hateful Donut" <gos...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>Oh how heartwarming. Pass the Rolaids.
>
>You can thank the Democrats in Congress for making sure that disabled
>students have every right to a public education. More often than not,
>disabled students are turned away by faith-based schools, simply because
>they do not have to follow the same laws. As a result, public schools are
>often slammed for being "more expensive" than sending a kid to spend the day
>learning with Prevo and his ilk. It's all too easy to overlook the cost of
>a public education for a disabled student, which can run into the tens of
>thousands per school year, versus just a few thousand for a "regular"
>student.
>
>I guess the moral of the story is that it's okay to lie to challenged
>students and create a phony world for them, because they won't be able to
>put two-and-two together, as long as it's done under the guise of "being
>godly". Puh-leeeeze.

And when they aren't lying to the students, I suspect that they make
up stories like the one below, essentially lying to themselves about
how the students somehow believe those kinds of lies and live happily
every after... but not on welfare or anything else paid for with their
precious tax dollars.

There is just something about simple minded solutions to complex problems
that I do NOT like. Most likely it is how those simple minded solutions
never _work_.

--
Floyd L. Davidson <http://www.ptialaska.net/~floyd>
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) fl...@barrow.com

alohacyberian

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Apr 19, 2001, 3:36:47 AM4/19/01
to
If you really believe that diatribe, don't send your kids to faith based
schools, but don't be surprised if others, even democrats, *shudder*
continue to do so in spite of your propaganda. KM

--
(-:alohacyberian:-) At my website there are 3000 live cameras or
visit NASA, play games, read jokes, send greeting cards & connect
to CNN news, NBA, the White House, Academy Awards or learn all
about Hawaii, Israel and more: http://keith.martin.home.att.net/


The Hateful Donut <gos...@bigfoot.com> wrote in article
<tdstfmo...@corp.supernews.com>...

Sammi

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Apr 19, 2001, 3:50:00 AM4/19/01
to
On 18 Apr 2001 22:16:02 -0800, Floyd Davidson <fl...@ptialaska.net>
wrote:

>>You can thank the Democrats in Congress for making sure that disabled
>>students have every right to a public education.

Thank them indeed.
Kids that refuse to pay attention are learning disabled, kids that are
violent or uncooperative are functional disabled.
They can't be suspended, they have the "right" to be in class and so
are put in classes with physically disabled students and proceed to
wreak their havoc there, denying education to the truly disabled.

Here's a little tip; Demmies have been in charge for eight years.
How's the public education system doing?

Sammi

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Apr 19, 2001, 3:51:32 AM4/19/01
to
On Wed, 18 Apr 2001 21:22:23 -0800, "The Hateful Donut"
<gos...@bigfoot.com> wrote:

> More often than not,
>disabled students are turned away by faith-based schools,

Interesting.
Could you provide the data used to reach this conclusion?

alohacyberian

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Apr 19, 2001, 4:39:11 AM4/19/01
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How can someone provide data for a conjecture he made up out of thin air?
You're asking a bit too much. KM

--
(-:alohacyberian:-) At my website there are 3000 live cameras or
visit NASA, play games, read jokes, send greeting cards & connect
to CNN news, NBA, the White House, Academy Awards or learn all
about Hawaii, Israel and more: http://keith.martin.home.att.net/


Sammi <sammi@_REMOVE_alt2600.com> wrote in article
<g76tdt4rqr88avdqj...@4ax.com>...

The Hateful Donut

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Apr 19, 2001, 9:27:44 PM4/19/01
to
It takes an awful lot of resources to educate one child, let alone a special
ed kid. Now of course not all SE kids are the same: some only require
additional tutoring and help, whereas others require special transportation,
a nurse, a therapist (sometimes two), someone to change their diapers, an
individualized education program (IEP), special workspaces, technology, etc.
There's a whole myriad of conditions. I believe that faith based schools
turn them away because they have no incentive to do otherwise. Faith based
schools focus almost exclusively on their ability to have smaller class
sizes. They're able to offer this because they do not have to meet the same
requirements of public schools (namely special ed costs). That is what I
base my position on--I suppose I could be wrong, but I think it holds water.
I'll try and find some DOE stats on it when I get the chance.

Do I believe that only Democratic politicians are willing to help people in
need? Absolutely.

"Some guy" <Sp...@spam.com> wrote in message
news:jivD6.3832$wq3.7...@news1.telusplanet.net...

Sammi

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Apr 19, 2001, 10:02:38 PM4/19/01
to
On Thu, 19 Apr 2001 17:27:44 -0800, "The Hateful Donut"
<gos...@bigfoot.com> wrote:

>Do I believe that only Democratic politicians are willing to help people in
>need? Absolutely.

Do you believe people should not be given the chance to help
themselves?
Seems Democrats keep people downtroddern so they can lord their
generous help.

Some guy

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Apr 19, 2001, 11:18:50 PM4/19/01
to
Why the sweeping generalizations? Dems, and Reps both help people, they both
have charitable instinct, and they both have proof of doing so in the past.
I think there is too much left/right bias here. You can't just sit there
with your political opinion, and bash everything else. Give others credit,
noone has faith in anyone else.

"Sammi" <sammi@_REMOVE_alt2600.com> wrote in message
news:o46vdto806m98lfck...@4ax.com...

George Partlow

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Apr 20, 2001, 12:54:23 AM4/20/01
to
Sammi wrote:

> Here's a little tip; Demmies have been in charge for eight years.
> How's the public education system doing?

As far as I know, public education in the United States is still controlled
by
a complex web of school boards, on the state, county, and municipal
level. It _may_ of course be the case that registered Democrats have "in
charge"
of the majority of these school boards across the country for the past
eight
years. I do not know. However, what I _do_ know about the few boards I
have
come in contact with makes me unwilling to accept your statement without
some
evidence.

As someone posted elsewhere in this newsgroup, "Interesting.


Could you provide the data used to reach this conclusion?"

George (registered "Independent" in Alaska, for a lot longer than eight
years)

Sammi

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Apr 20, 2001, 1:20:16 AM4/20/01
to
On Thu, 19 Apr 2001 20:54:23 -0800, George Partlow <mac...@gci.net>
wrote:

Do I really need to provide data showing that a Democrat has been
President the last 8 years?
Stating the fact that a Democrat has been in charge requires
substantially less backing than stating that special needs children
are routinely turned away from private schools.
The former is common knowledge and a given, the latter is an
accusation lacking any substance.
Leadership flows from the top down, and for Dems to be crying about
the deplorable state of education, while shooting down everything
Republicans propose, is incredulous yet typical.

alohacyberian

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Apr 20, 2001, 2:36:14 AM4/20/01
to
Thanks for a breath of fresh air. Reading some biased political remarks
almost makes me wonder if those people think democrats and republicans are
2 different species who and were born that way and can't crossbreed. When
I hear someone claim, "well, that's the way Alaskans are, or this is the
way Chinese are, or Californians or Americans or Europeans or Blacks, or
Catholics or Masons or Engineers or Students or Democrats or Republicans, I
just shake my head. Many individuals who belong to a a group don't share
all the same beliefs as the others in the group or necessarily accept the
orthodox or mainstream beliefs of the organization. Making blanket
statements about any large group of people is just plain ignorant. People
are people and every large group has a cross section of personal beliefs.
KM

--
(-:alohacyberian:-) At my website there are 3000 live cameras or
visit NASA, play games, read jokes, send greeting cards & connect
to CNN news, NBA, the White House, Academy Awards or learn all
about Hawaii, Israel and more: http://keith.martin.home.att.net/


Some guy <Sp...@spam.com> wrote in article
<uUND6.575$iw5.2...@news0.telusplanet.net>...

The Hateful Donut

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Apr 20, 2001, 11:14:16 AM4/20/01
to
Bullshit. We are a free country, and everyone has the chance to "help
themselves" on their own if that's what they want. Nobody is force feeding
anything to anyone.

"Sammi" <sammi@_REMOVE_alt2600.com> wrote in message
news:o46vdto806m98lfck...@4ax.com...

Floyd Davidson

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Apr 20, 2001, 11:34:20 AM4/20/01
to
"The Hateful Donut" <gos...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>Bullshit. We are a free country, and everyone has the chance to "help
>themselves" on their own if that's what they want. Nobody is force feeding
>anything to anyone.

But, but, but... how the Heck are the oil companies supposed to
make big bucks on their own if we give it only to people who
don't have millions? You think they invested so much in
Republicans like George W. to have it given to people who enter
by the back door?

>"Sammi" <sammi@_REMOVE_alt2600.com> wrote in message
>news:o46vdto806m98lfck...@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 19 Apr 2001 17:27:44 -0800, "The Hateful Donut"
>> <gos...@bigfoot.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Do I believe that only Democratic politicians are willing to help people in
>> >need? Absolutely.
>>
>> Do you believe people should not be given the chance to help
>> themselves?
>> Seems Democrats keep people downtroddern so they can lord their
>> generous help.

I'd rather be lorded over because I was given generous help than
ignored by someone walking on me.

Sammi

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Apr 20, 2001, 5:43:05 PM4/20/01
to
On Fri, 20 Apr 2001 07:14:16 -0800, "The Hateful Donut"
<gos...@bigfoot.com> wrote:

>Bullshit. We are a free country, and everyone has the chance to "help
>themselves" on their own if that's what they want. Nobody is force feeding
>anything to anyone.

Do you really think the dem policy of racial division, class warfare,
and fostering victim mentality is helping?
You're quite right, this country gives everyone the chance to help
themselves *in spite* of dem tactics.
Demmies simply do their best to keep the classes defined, divided and
at war.
It's their livelihood.

Dennis P. Harris

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Apr 20, 2001, 7:42:28 PM4/20/01
to
On Fri, 20 Apr 2001 13:43:05 -0800 in alt.culture.alaska, Sammi
<sammi@_REMOVE_alt2600.com> wrote:

> Do you really think the dem policy of racial division, class warfare,
> and fostering victim mentality is helping?

Let's see ---

The Repugnicans do everything they can to discriminate against
minorities while calling it "choice", and then accuse Democrats
of "divisiveness".

They promote unneeded tax cuts for the rich and ultra-rich, while
stopping income tax audits for the rich but requiring them for
the working poor who have to work 2 minimum wage jobs just to
feed their kids and keep a roof over their heads.

Then when the tired poor folks complain that the rich get all the
benefit of their labor, they foster right to starve bills so that
unions are too weak to bargain for a living wage or health care
benefits, deny them medical care when underfunded hospital
emergency rooms are overflowing, and accuse them of having a
"victim mentality".

This the Repugnicans, with their 1984-type doublespeak, call
"freedom".

> You're quite right, this country gives everyone the chance to help
> themselves *in spite* of dem tactics.

Without the progress that Democrats made toward a society where
the poor actually have a *chance* to have better education, a
living wage, equal rights for women and minorities, decent
housing, food without poisons, clean air, clean water, and rural
electrification, many people would not have survived to have a
chance to help themselves! The Repugnicans and their rich and
powerful Big Business friends would have kept them in subjugation
and debt, like they did for most of the 19th and the early part
of the 20th century.

> Demmies simply do their best to keep the classes defined, divided and
> at war.

There is indeed class warfare in this country. It's a war of the
rich and powerful against poor people, women, and minorities.
The Repugnicans do their best to divide and conquer by using
bigotry and narrow-mindedness to keep working class blacks and
whites from realizing that their enemies are not those of another
race or religious persuasion, but the corporate moguls and their
fat cat lobbyists. It's a divide-and-conquer tactic that they've
been using since the days they had Pinkerton guards illegally
assaulting peaceful picketers.

> It's their livelihood.

No, it's their CAUSE. If they wanted to make a lot of money from
it they'd be working for the corporate slavemasters, just like
most of the Repugnicans.

==============================================================
"We live in the country, but we ain't stupid. We know that
Democrats work for a living and Repugnicans make a living off
of people who work." --- Jan Flora
=================================================================
"Passing a tax cut that gives 42.5 percent of the cut to the
wealthiest 1 percent of the citizens is, in fact, class warfare."
--- Molly Ivins

NO_SPAM_T...@gci.net
http://www.ejuneau.net


Sammi

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Apr 20, 2001, 7:53:25 PM4/20/01
to
On Fri, 20 Apr 2001 15:42:28 -0800, NO_SPAM_T...@gci.net
(Dennis P. Harris) wrote:

>On Fri, 20 Apr 2001 13:43:05 -0800 in alt.culture.alaska, Sammi
><sammi@_REMOVE_alt2600.com> wrote:
>
>> Do you really think the dem policy of racial division, class warfare,
>> and fostering victim mentality is helping?
>
>Let's see ---
>
>The Repugnicans do everything they can to discriminate against
>minorities while calling it "choice", and then accuse Democrats
>of "divisiveness".

That's rather generic.
Got any specifics?

>They promote unneeded tax cuts for the rich and ultra-rich, while
>stopping income tax audits for the rich but requiring them for
>the working poor who have to work 2 minimum wage jobs just to
>feed their kids and keep a roof over their heads.

Can you define "rich" and "ultra-rich" and then explain why it should
be legal to discriminate against them?
Can you explain how riling the "poor" about tax cuts for the "rich" is
not a policy of divisiveness?
Stopping income tax audits for the rich? Examples please.

>Then when the tired poor folks complain that the rich get all the
>benefit of their labor, they foster right to starve bills so that
>unions are too weak to bargain for a living wage or health care
>benefits, deny them medical care when underfunded hospital
>emergency rooms are overflowing, and accuse them of having a
>"victim mentality".

That's a lot of rhetoric, not much fact though.

>This the Repugnicans, with their 1984-type doublespeak, call
>"freedom".
>
>> You're quite right, this country gives everyone the chance to help
>> themselves *in spite* of dem tactics.
>
>Without the progress that Democrats made toward a society where
>the poor actually have a *chance* to have better education, a
>living wage, equal rights for women and minorities, decent
>housing, food without poisons, clean air, clean water, and rural
>electrification, many people would not have survived to have a
>chance to help themselves! The Repugnicans and their rich and
>powerful Big Business friends would have kept them in subjugation
>and debt, like they did for most of the 19th and the early part
>of the 20th century.

The Dems have been in power for eight years.
What happened?

>> Demmies simply do their best to keep the classes defined, divided and
>> at war.
>
>There is indeed class warfare in this country.

As your post so aptly demonstrates.

> It's a war of the
>rich and powerful against poor people, women, and minorities.
>The Repugnicans do their best to divide and conquer by using
>bigotry and narrow-mindedness to keep working class blacks and
>whites from realizing that their enemies are not those of another
>race or religious persuasion, but the corporate moguls and their
>fat cat lobbyists. It's a divide-and-conquer tactic that they've
>been using since the days they had Pinkerton guards illegally
>assaulting peaceful picketers.

Wow, talk about projection.

>> It's their livelihood.
>
>No, it's their CAUSE.

Indeed.

>"Passing a tax cut that gives 42.5 percent of the cut to the
>wealthiest 1 percent of the citizens is, in fact, class warfare."
> --- Molly Ivins

Leaving aside the utter moronity of this statement " 42.4% of the cut
to the wealthiest 1 percent"...

Promoting legal discrimination is, in fact, class warfare.

Hey son, try this; instead of dragging everyone down to the lowest
level, why not encourage people to improve their lives?

Then, try some objective thinking rather than regurgitating Demmie
pap.

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